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Buying Pure Nicotine

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#61
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View PostDanielD, on 12 June 2011 - 04:49 PM, said:

I am scared after hearing this, many new vapors can get into serious trouble without even knowing if something like this continues.

There's nothing to be scared of provided you stay legal and sensible.

I'm not sure if the message came across clearly, but this warning thread was about 100% (i.e. 1000mg per ml) liquid. Even with the legal 7.5% (75mg per ml) liquid, you would have to absorb a fair bit to cause harm. I would go as far as to say you'd need to be pretty reckless in fact. A millilitre is quite a lot to absorb without actually drinking the stuff.
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#62
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Indeed, if it was pure nicotine ( 1000mg) you wouldn't have to worry about getting it on your skin... the fumes would kill you first.
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#63
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View PostBenp, on 13 June 2011 - 12:54 PM, said:

Indeed, if it was pure nicotine ( 1000mg) you wouldn't have to worry about getting it on your skin... the fumes would kill you first.

I still reckon Hifi Stud could use it as a body lotion ;)

#64
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The company in question is now selling it in drums of 10 litres!

And beware of Green House One, too.
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#65
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Hi All I will be doing a report on this on this Fridays Show
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That's great, Tony :)
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View Posttony2stix, on 21 February 2012 - 04:01 PM, said:

Hi All I will be doing a report on this on this Fridays Show
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Tony i have nicked your sig pic, if you have a problem with that i can recomend a good lawyer :tongue:
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#68
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SSSSooo gald to have you to remind people on such atrocity. i for one may of been such person that might of not seen or understood, simply because the site or bottle didnt say of a warning
Thanks

#69
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You're welcome :)

Spread the word.
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#70
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I am now aware of at least one company advertising pure nicotine to vapers via e-mail.
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#71
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View PostOnceupon, on 21 February 2012 - 03:04 PM, said:

The company in question is now selling it in drums of 10 litres!

And beware of Green House One, too.

In that case, I'm sure many one here would be well up for a Group Buy then and we should start a new thread to that end? :smokin:
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#72
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View PostCrossbow, on 25 September 2010 - 12:11 AM, said:

It's almost certainly illegal to import though.

But is it?

And I wonder why admin seem convinced that the handling of nicotine over 75mg/ml without a licence is illegal, when our Katherine knows of no such legal restriction.


Edited by Onceupon, 23 February 2012 - 04:06 AM.

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View PostDanielD, on 12 June 2011 - 04:49 PM, said:

I am scared after hearing this, many new vapors can get into serious trouble without even knowing if something like this continues.

Are you sure this questionable site isn't lying? I can't imagine an e-juice mfr buying litre bottles at that density. It would be easier to transport several gallons at 1% strength, that would be high enough. I reckon the site means it's 100% solution, not 1000mg/ml. The only people that would want that kind of density would be toxicology departments, and they'd only want it in a tiny file. Even if it was to be used as industrial fertiliser it would still only be 10% strength. If this place was really offering such a high concentration I think the staff would have since snuffed it.

#74
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View PostOnceupon, on 21 February 2012 - 03:04 PM, said:

And beware of Green House One, too.

I ordered 10 low res atties from them on the 1st of December. Still haven't seen them.
Talk of refunds and then nothing. No response since 09/02/12 :(
Very disappointed with them.

#75
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View PostOnceupon, on 23 February 2012 - 02:24 AM, said:

View PostCrossbow, on 25 September 2010 - 12:11 AM, said:

It's almost certainly illegal to import though.

But is it?



And I wonder why admin seem convinced that the handling of nicotine over 75mg/ml without a licence is illegal, when our Katherine knows of no such legal restriction.


Hmmm... interesting question.

Poisons Act 1972 said:

Regulation of sale of poisons.

(1)Subject to the provisions of this Act, it shall not be lawful—


(a)for a person to sell any non-medicinal poison which is a substance included in Part I of the Poisons List, unless—


(i)he is a person lawfully conducting a retail pharmacy business, and
(ii)the sale is effected on premises which are a registered pharmacy, and
(iii)the sale is effected by, or under the supervision of, a pharmacist;


(b)for a person to sell any non-medicinal poison which is a substance included in Part II of the Poisons List, unless—


(i)he is a person lawfully conducting a retail pharmacy business and the sale is effected on premises which are a registered pharmacy, or
(ii)his name is entered in a local authority’s list in respect of the premises on which the poison is sold;
©for a person to sell any non-medicinal poison, whether it is a substance included in Part I or in Part II of the Poisons List, unless the container of the poison is labelled in the prescribed manner—


(i)with the name of the poison, and
(ii)in the case of a preparation which contains a poison as one of its ingredients, with the prescribed particulars as to the proportion which the poison contained in the preparation bears to the total ingredients, and
(iii)with the word “poison” or other prescribed indication of the character of the article, and
(iv)with the name of the seller of the poison and the address of the premises on which it is sold.


(2)Subject to the provisions of this Act—


(a)it shall not be lawful to sell any non-medicinal poison which is a substance included in Part I of the Poisons List to any person unless that person is either—

(i)certified in writing in the prescribed manner by a person authorised by the Poisons Rule to give a certificate for the purposes of this section, or
(ii)known by the seller or by a pharmacist in the employment of the seller at the premises where the sale is effected,
to be a person to whom the poison may properly be sold;


(b)the seller of any such poison shall not deliver it until—


(i)he has made or caused to be made an entry in a book to be kept for that purpose stating in the prescribed form the date of the sale, the name and address of the purchaser and of the person (if any) by whom the certificate required under paragraph (a) above was given, the name and quantity of the article sold, and the purposes for which it is stated by the purchaser to be required, and
(ii)the purchaser has signed the entry.


(3)Subject to the provisions of this Act, it shall not be lawful for a non-medicinal poison to be exposed for sale in, or to be offered for sale by means of, an automatic machine.

Now, if you check the list you'll find that "Nicotine; its salts and quarternary compounds" is a Part II poison, but with an exemption listed of "Some preparations with not more than 7½ % nicotine solution". Further reading reveals that the specific (Schedule 4) exemption that applies in this case is "...other liquid preparations, and solid preparations with a soap base, containing not more than 7.5 per cent of nicotine, weight in weight."

So far, so good; it's obvious from the Act that it's unlawful to sell nicotine in concentrations higher than 7.5%, except in accordance with the provisions of the Act. In the 1982 (as amended) Poison Rules, it becomes clear that the supply of nicotine is also unlawful except in accordance et cetera.

What I can't for the life of me find is anything in the legislation rendering unlawful the ownership or purchase of these substances. It may well be in another enactment, but there doesn't seem to be anything in either the Poisons Act or the Rules that says you can't have the stuff for your own personal use. There are rules pertaining to storage of poisons that arguably apply to their not-for-sale-or-supply possession, but the requirements are sensible and easily met. There are rules pertaining to consigning poisons for transport but those, too, are proportionate and simple. All the controls, however, seem only to relate to in some manner giving the poison to someone else... if you should happen to have a barrel of nicotine in your cellar, it seems from a brief investigation that you can do with it what you want provided you don't harm anyone.

So, >7.5% nicotine can't be sold or supplied within the UK without licensing and whatnot, but my (admittedly cursory) examination of the legislation I've found so far seems to suggest that you can buy a drum of it from China and pour it in your ears if you want to without actually breaking the law. The sellers might be breaking UK law by sending it to you, but - providing the packaging is adequate for consignment to transport - the worst that could be pinned on you is the commission of an unlawful act, and even that's dubious when the act is actually perpetrated in a country where it's legal.

Of course, there may well be something elsewhere about importing or soliciting the importation of scheduled poisons - in which case you'd be committing a crime by having it brought into the country - but my interest in this doesn't really go far enough for me to make the effort to find out more about the legality of doing something that only someone completely insane would want to do anyway ;)
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#76
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The limit is indeed on supply, but in terms of import, high strength or pure nicotine solutions would require an external hazard warning (GHS class 6.1) to comply with transport regulations, and then the Post Office will not deliver it.
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More importantly, the symbol is there for a reason - high strength (or pure) nicotine is extremely dangerous. Sensible strength nicotine solutions aren't exactly hugely expensive, so why take the risk?

Also worth considering is the fact that there is a frame of regulations that nicotine solutions fit in a way that makes them available - breaking these laws is only likely to generate interest in making a new framework, which is almost certain to be even more restrictive.
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#77
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Nicotine is sure like no poison I've heard of. I am no chemist. If 60mg is fatal, then how people who smoke 60 a day, 7 days a week and survive with no ill effect for years I really cannot fathom. This is based on 1mg of nicotine being released per traditional cigarette. I guess that's why Napoleon wasn't poisoned with nicotine, for if 60mg were put in his wine it would enter the body too dilute? Whereas use of the less toxic Strychnine or Arsenic - it's potency is not reduced with dilution.?

Still, cinnamon sticks can apparently cause organ failure if chewed on. I bet caffein is deadly when consumed neat. No one in their right mind would purchase barrels of 100% pure caffein in order to make coffee.

Undoubtedly there are lots of Mary Whitehouses waiting in the wings to claim that Nicotine is more deadly than Plutonium, to further their personal crusades. Whilst many an innocuous substance can become lethal in certain forms, i.e. pineapple and rhubarb, one cannot assume without clear evidence that Nicotine is a poison in all its forms. And pharmaceutical grade Nicotine is not the same as Nicotine combined in tobacco, as in it's natural state it's molecular structure is less uniform and therein more suited as a natural pesticide? Just guessing. I'm very confused.

#78
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It's all about dose vs time - 60 cigs at (a guestimated 1mg each) deliver 60mg in 18 hours (assuming you only smoke while awake :p ).The half life of nicotine in the body is estimated at between one and two hours, so you never really build up a significant amount, but 60mg all in one go is a different matter. Even vaping a 60mg juice, you'd be hard pushed to vape a whole milliliter in under an hour...
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#79
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Great topic covered here. Specially to newbie vapers, to avoid unwanted results to themselves or to others around them. I found a topic back in ECF covering the conversion formula for Nicotine from mg to ml widely used by DIY eJuice makers like myself and manufacturers alike.

Basically Nicotine is toxic and should be handled with care. No need to compare it with other poisons/ toxins it is and will always be deadly specially in higher dosages, no need to have a degree in chemistry to accept that fact. Analog quitters who switched to vaping should know that best. Vape on peeps! :skull:
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#80
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There really is absolutely no need for 98% Nicotine whatsoever, its absolutely crazy!! :angry: