14 replies to this topic

[Crundy]

Does anyone know if PG is actually absorbed into the bloodstream through the lungs? If so then eSmoking could potentially be harmful for people with impaired renal function:

http://www.atypon-li...1.13.1140.34611

The patient had impaired renal function through chronic cocaine use and was given a Lorazepam infusion which contained PG. As the patient's kidneys could not filter out the PG effectively, it accumulated in their system and caused numerous problems. Therefore I wonder if a sufficient amount of PG is absorbed through the lungs by an eSmoker who has a renal condition it might cause the same symptoms?

Quote

Agents containing PG should be avoided in patients with compromised renal function (creatinine clearance ≤ 30 ml/min)

[DaveK]

As someone with only one kidney - I'd really like to know the answer to that

[Toby]

I know someone who has impaired renal function who has been e-smoking for over 2 years, mainly PG, and hasn't noticed any difference...

But yes, we need some kind of doctor/scientist consultant on UKV!

[DaveK]

Found this here

Quote

Infants and children below the age of 4 years, pregnant women and those with kidney dysfunction or in renal failure are not able to eliminate propylene glycol in the body. According to the FDA, this inability to process and eliminate this product causes potential adverse reactions in infants and pregnant women as well as those with kidney problems.
Read more: http://www.livestron.../#ixzz1E7giGvAp

It doesn't suggest what the "potential adverse reactions" might be though.....

[Crundy]

My link just says:

Quote

Forty-eight hours into the infusion the patient experienced anion gap metabolic acidosis with hyperlactatemia, hyperosmolality, and increased osmolal gap.

But that is an isolated case.

[Crundy]

Toby, on 16 February 2011 - 12:08 PM, said:

I know someone who has impaired renal function who has been e-smoking for over 2 years, mainly PG, and hasn't noticed any difference...

I very much doubt there would be any issue with eSmoking, because even if PG is absorbed through the lungs the quantity would be negligable. However, we do really need, as a community, to investigate all potential problems regardless of how low their risk factor or impact is.

[Cat]

There are studies out there, but they are general ones, not specific to any particular body reaction, such as the break-down product of creatine phosphate in muscle.

Until those studies are thought essential, we have to make do with what is out there. (Something I will be chatting about in next weeks 'The Witching Hour' on Vapourtrails.tv)

As you say Toby, we need some people with a real knowledge to assist with finding the answers.

[DaveK]

Crundy, on 16 February 2011 - 12:36 PM, said:

Toby, on 16 February 2011 - 12:08 PM, said:

I know someone who has impaired renal function who has been e-smoking for over 2 years, mainly PG, and hasn't noticed any difference...

I very much doubt there would be any issue with eSmoking, because even if PG is absorbed through the lungs the quantity would be negligable. However, we do really need, as a community, to investigate all potential problems regardless of how low their risk factor or impact is.

I completely agree

[Crundy]

Cat, on 16 February 2011 - 12:42 PM, said:

As you say Toby, we need some people with a real knowledge to assist with finding the answers.

Well, I can give (limited) help with any pharmacology / toxicology discussions, but I don't work in a lab any more so I can't do my own research :\

[googled]

I'm pretty sure if PG inhalation was a problem the FDA would have jumped on that and the reason they didn't is probably because it's been used in medical scenarios for decades.

[lovematt]

DaveK, on 16 February 2011 - 12:00 PM, said:

As someone with only one kidney - I'd really like to know the answer to that

oohhhhhh a guinea pig, how do you feel dave ?

[nesf]

I have read on ECF by some of the more medical types that lung absorption should be fairly minor due to the size of the PG droplets. It is reflected somewhat in the different nicotine level in blood versus cigarettes with vaping having a longer smoother increase in nicotine versus cigarettes and their high spike in nicotine and sharp drop off, this reflected again in the lack of severe cravings for vapers versus smokers.

[Christophe]

Hello,

Not sure where I found that, if it has already been posted I'm sorry about that. I am aware that it is from a vaping website, which could be only posting 'positive' studies towards the use of PG but it looks rather good overall. Take a look at the original articles, do not rely on someone's judgment in just reading his/her summary. Be your own leader!

http://www.vapersclub.com/pg.php

[fynger]

DaveK, on 16 February 2011 - 12:00 PM, said:

As someone with only one kidney - I'd really like to know the answer to that

Hi ...me too...welcome to the one Kidney club.

[DaveK]

Cheers